[PDX] downtown or public-transit available?
I'm going to be in downtown Portland (Broadway+Washington) for three days. No car, so places must be nearby or available on public transit. My companion won't touch seafood. I love just about any cuisine, especially the more esoteric ones that we don't have around home (non-Asian).
We tend to be cheap, though: if the entrees go above $15 we start to cringe, and $6-12 is more my "normal" range. As an example, the Papa Haydn dinner menu is about as high as I'd go, unless it's astoundingly good food.
I've spent the last few days soaking up information from here, but there's really a whole lot, and I'm not quite positive where things are -- or more importantly, if we can get there on light rail or streetcar.
Karam is definitely on my list, as is trying out the food carts. Other than that, I just have a splattering of vague ideas.
El Palmero (Peruvian/Mexican) -- near where I'm staying, but I didn't see much mention of it. Are there better places (of either cuisine)?
Higgin's - is it worth it just for the food if we weren't having beer?
Low's BBQ got great (and recent) mentions, but looks like it's waaaay out east. How long/difficult would it be to get out there? Would it be worth the transit time?
We have great Asian food where I live -- is it worth going to Sungari Pearl, or Pho Van? Or any place in Chinatown? Hot Pot City looked interesting, but not so hot for a non-seafood eater.
Cafe Voila - anyone know what their menu is for Friday? (I can't find a link to sign up to get the menu)
Is Alexis one of the better Greek options? Their menu looks good, but it's hard to tell.
Breakfast places: Mother's? Bijou Cafe? We're probably going to want places very close to the hotel, but will have three breakfast meals.
Thanks...
Merle
Apr 24, 2005 02:32PM
Welcome to Portland.
Where are you from? This could help in suggesting recs beyond what you've asked for comments on.
First, thing, familiarize yourself with these two sites:
http://www.trimet.org
http://www.portlandstreetcar.org
Not that there's a "fareless square" consisting mostly of downtown out to Lloyd Center where all public transit is free.
On Greek: I'd suggest walking a couple extra blocks and going to Eleni's rather than Alexis. I'd have to look at the menus to be sure, but I think Eleni's is slightly more expensive. None of the Greek I've had in Portland, though, is as good for its cuisine as Karam is for its cuisine. And given their moderate similarity, I'd rather have more meals at Karam, especially if you don't eat seafood.
On Breakfast: I'm not a big fan of Bijou. Personally, I'd rather hop on the Max and go to the Lloyd Center area and hit Cadillac or Milo's. Or better (but definitely can be spendy for breakfast) taking the Streetcar to the Pearl and going to Daily Cafe. Mother's, though, is a very good choice. You could take the 15 Bus (Belmont Bus) from downtown down Belmont and go to Zell's. You could also walk or take the Streetcar or take the Max over to The Pearl/Chinatown area and go to Park Kitchen for breakfast. You could also get something lighter at any of the several quality bakeries, either The Pearl Bakery, Ken's Artisan, or Grand Central (in Irvington/Lloyd) are all near easy transit from downtown. It'd be a shame to miss out on Portland's artisan bakeries.
On Higgins: Higgins is going to break your budget constraints for their normal menu where entrees are over $20. Their bistro/bar menu will fit your requirements and is pretty good considering it's close and fits your budget. It wouldn't be my first choice for that food, but it's certainly not a bad choice. I'd rather take the 14 Bus (Hawthorne Bus) to Ken's Place myself.
On Voila: I post Voila's menu weekly when they send it out. You will be able to find it here tomorrow, I would think:
http://www.extramsg.com/modules.php?name=News
On Asian: Sungari, Pho Van, and Bewon (Korean) all are good choices for your budget. You can probably do fine money-wise and they provide a nice setting with good execution and high quality ingredients. You're in a fine restaurant (midscale, truly), but the prices are lower than they might be elsewhere because it's not French or Italian. They're all very easy to access via transit.
On LOW BBQ: You can reach LOW (Mondays only) and Apizza Scholls (W-Su) via the 14 Bus (Hawthorne Bus). It's just a straight shot from downtown for these major buslines. I just measured it on my mapping program and it's about 3 miles from downtown. I don't think it'd take you long by bus.
Link: http://www.extramsg.com
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Thanks for the swift reply!
I'm from the Oakland, CA area (near SF). Good Asian out here, although Indian is a bit lacking (unless I'm willing to drive). There's almost zero middle eastern food, which is why Karam and Alexis (or Eleni) make the list.
Saw the Met and streetcar sites from a previous post of yours. I know there's a "visitor's pass" of some sort, which I assume gets me on anything? Really I need to print out the maps, go past AAA, and get a highlighter, so I can draw in the transit lines.
Park Kitchen does look like a good brunch spot. The lunch/dinner menus didn't appeal to my other half, and I simply missed the brunch link. To be honest, I chose Mother's because of proximity: I wake up ravenous and incoherent, so planning a long jaunt to breakfast isn't wise for me. But if the other places are right off the light rail, I might be able to manage it.
Re the budget constraints: they're not hard and fast. I'm happy dropping more money at a unique, or local cuisine, place. But $20 teriyaki I can live without. ;-)
Hadn't picked Higgin's so much for the cuisine, just that it was mentioned often. Didn't know about the cost; the review I saw was of the bar... I saw Ken's Place, too, but it was further away. Do you know of any online menu for Ken's Place? I love the fact that many places have them online.
Argh, I had not noticed that Low's BBQ was only open on Monday. I'm there Thu-Sun. Doh! Guess I should try Campbell's instead? (good BBQ is another thing that we don't have out here)
You like Ochoa's in Hillsboro for Mexican? Your description of the huaraches definitely made me hungry...
And -- thanks for the beta Portland tip sheet I found off of (cough) "that other food board". Very nice to have a concise thing to print out.
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Yeah, you've definitely got more good Asian than we do, especially Indian when you include Berkeley in that east bay contingent. When you decide on these places, you can compare them to Slanted Door in style, more or less. I'd suggest Bewon for something different, but you really should get the $25 fixed price dinner if you go.
The big problem, really, is that style-wise Northern California and Oregon's foods are very similar. Basically, I think you'll have a hard finding better food in Portland and truly unique food as compared with the Bay Area. But there are plenty of places I would put right in there.
I think we may do as good or better with upscale Mexican, eg. (We'd clearly do better, I think, if Azul was still around.) I think that Taqueria Nueve, Nuestra Cocina, and DF are all at Dona Tomas's level. And they're all more or less in your budget and reachable by bus or transit. You could also look at Andina for Peruvian. It's mid/upscale. There are plenty of dishes that are budget breakers, but if you order smartly, you can do quite well. Unfortunately, their best thing, imo, the ceviches, aren't for you. But they're an option.
Ochoa is on the Max line and is quite good. I think it'd do just fine in The Mission or in Fruitvale. There are a few other places nearby that are quite good as well.
If you go the other way on the Max, you can get about a 1/4 mile from Tortilleria y Tienda de Leon, which makes very good guisados and frijoles and carnitas. It's at least as good as Ochoa and the two don't really overlap in food.
If you like Mexican and want cheap food, either of these would be really good choices. I don't know exactly how much time it'd take to get there, but min 20 minutes to either by train, I would think. They're pretty far.
Again, don't overlook the bakeries if you like glutinous carbs. Consider Italian at Basta's or Italian-American at Mama Mia's. Mother's is more or less in your price range, too, for dinner. Consider some of the bistro level places, like Ken's Place, Cafe Castagna, and Carafe. Consider places that have small plates, like clarklewis, Tabla, and Noble Rot.
Do you drink at all, or just not beer? I don't drink and still will go to happy hours for cheap food and just buy something non-alcoholic.
Lastly, feel free to email me if you'd like a culinary tour while you're in town. If I have the time, I'd be glad to give you one. Or if you wanted a bite somewhere that seems like a pain, such as Ochoa or de Leon or (the much harder to get to) Salvador's in Woodburn.
Enjoy.
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If you are from Oakland, I wouldn't cry over missing Low's. It's okay, but no better (albeit different) than Flint's or Doug's in Emeryville. (RIP Vic and Betty's Soul BBQ in SF, IMHO.) If Low's is not open while you are here, skip it. [Note to Nick: Can they get Low's at the Market?] Campbell's is neither convenient nor worth the trouble to get there. Even more to the point, although Portland now has some good cheap Mexican, most of it is not too transit-friendly, and someone who can get to the Mission should do other things while here, I would think. I defer to Nick on the upscale Mexican assessment -- though I don't recall that particular option from SF when I lived there -- and concur that it is too bad Azul is gone. Haven't been to DF, but it has good buzz.
Nick has far more credentials on this board than I, but that doesn't mean I am any less opinionated! And my opinion is that I don't understand what the fuss is about Karam. For my money, if you want a cheap, tasty, funky little middle Eastern place, Nicholas's on SE Grand across the river is a better destination. I prefer the food. Maybe I haven't given Karam enough of a chance, but based on two visits, that's my take.
Eleni's is perhaps better for a his-and-her little sitdown dinner, but I find the food at Alexis to be good (although not as good), and they do the boisterous "Opa!"-type thing better than Eleni's. If you go to Eleni's, would be curious to hear your opinion as to whether they abuse garlic powder. . .
Park Kitchen is very good, but will not likely blow off any SF socks.
More dissonance: I have eaten at bijou on and off for about 25 years, and have never had a bad meal. I went to Mother's once and never went back. Cadillac has the best French toast in the world, so far as I can see. Milo's is unremarkable. Papa Haydn's is a good breakfast choice, though crowded. Gravy up on N. Mississippi is also good, although modest, and maybe not worth the transit shenanigans necessary to get there.
Higgins can be okay, but I'd second Nick that you should hop the bus over to Ken's Place instead. If he is serving the braised short ribs, don't miss them. Ken's also has both the best Caesar's (I definitely mean to include Gino's when I say this) and the best cassoulet in town, when the latter is on the menu.
Asian vis a vis SF? Fuhgeddaboudit, esp in Chinatown. Pho Van is okay. Bewon is not in Chinatown, rather in NW (21st, I think, should be pretty streetcarrable), but I thought it (based on little experience) the most extraordinary Korean restaurant I have eaten at in this country. Not only is the food exquisite, but the decor is lovely. The only other thing to know about Asian downtown is Murata, at 200 SW Market, a small, clean, wonderful little Japanese restaurant and sushi bar.
Doable by MAX yellow line, and worth a visit I'd say, is Happy Hula Hands, a reasonable, eclectic little restaurant in an old coral pink house. It rather defies easy description, but is somehow quintessentially Portland. The cuisine is sort of Pacific Rim/NW fusion.
There's my $.02. Happy eatin'!
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The best thing I've ever had from Higgins, which I had tonight again at Taste of the Nation, is their charcuterie and pickled items, all made in house. Smoked pork neck, pickled fiddleheads -- mmm, good stuff.
Since Rodney is working on Saturdays at Apizza Scholls and since their pit is in the back yard of Apizza Scholls, they won't be doing BBQ at the market (dammit). I'd disagree with saying LOW isn't worth a trip. I'd make it a stop even if it were in KC, and definitely if it were in a lesser BBQ town like Dallas. But that's neither here-nor-there since they won't be able to try it. I agree that the others aren't really worth the trouble unless they have a serious jones for BBQ.
Is there anything in Portland that trumps SF? Really? SF is a worldclass food city (especially when you expand out to the entire bay area and wine country). Chicago, NY, and SF are usually named as the best food cities in the country.
I know that at this website:
http://www.kqed.org/weblog/food/2005/...
They're claiming that Apizza Scholls is better than anything they can find.
I'm not super-experienced in the bay area, but I've made a few food trips there eating at both high end and low end restaurants from Napa and Sonoma to the South Bay. I do think we have some things that would be welcome in SF/Bay Area. I think our artisan bakeries, eg, could give ACME a run. I think LOW BBQ would be a welcome addition to any town I've eaten BBQ in. I think the same of Apizza Scholls. I've toured the Mission and Fruitvale/Franklin area of Oakland on several occasions and never found *better* than Salvador's, Ochoa, de Leon, or Poncho's. (I think any of these would do quite well in Mexico itself.
)
SF clearly goes way beyond us at the top end and Asian. I wish Portland could compete more. We haven't even caught up with Seattle on destination/special occasion dining. Thank God for Hurley's. Though I do think our *** restaurants out-perform *** restaurants I've been to in other towns on food. It's like we have **** food, but people aren't willing to pay for the next bump up in service, decor, wine service, etc. Now, our **** is **** in Chez Panisse's mold, not in French Laundry's, but it does the job nonetheless. (Though I would also argue less consistently.)
I do think Pho Van does quite well. Is it really any worse than Slanted Door? Same with Sungari. Is it really any worse than Yank Sing? (Maybe in creativity? These aren't just rhetorical questions.)
Another place I think is quite good and would be welcomed anywhere (at its price level): Pambiche. And the aforementioned other Latin places, especially Mexican midscale.
Lots of good Italian at their price levels, too.
PS: I'm glad you're opinionated. It'd be pretty boring around here if we all agreed. And we might become too complacent in our own opinions without having to back them up.
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To be honest, I don't think too highly of SF bay area BBQ. Some of them have good sauces or rubs, or are executed well, but the beef and pork just don't seem to be as high of a quality. Not sure why. (oh, and Flint's is closed, BTW).
Hadn't even thought about pizza as an option, but Apizza Scholls does sound interesting. I like their minimal topping philosophy.
Italian might be an option. I've gotten poisoned off of Italian because everywhere out here is "California Italian", which is quite a different beast, so I don't even think about it when travelling...
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I seriously considered Pambiche, but read a couple of reviews that said there was always a wait, and that the tables were very cramped... which dropped the appeal factor. But maybe for a lunch it would be less crowded...
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It is usually much less crowded for lunch. They're also open quite late on weekends. It is small and there's usually a wait. There'll probably be a wait for Apizza Scholls, too, unless you show up in the first hour. I usually go to Pambiche by about 5:30 and get right in.
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Pambiche stays crowded until pretty late, too--whenever we drive by we look and usually the outside tables are still filled at 11:30. Before 6 or for lunch are better bets.
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Karam was near the top of the list simply because: (a) we don't have much food like that near where I live (without going into SF); (b) it's walkable from our hotel; (c) it did get good mention here.
But foremost was (d), they were one of the first Portland restaurants I researched. And their online menu is nice. I'm a sucker for good web sites. ;-)
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I guess I should just post a link to my food journal, indicating what sort of things I normally eat. March includes my Ashland, OR trip. (previous months are more varied in restaurants, because work has been harsh recently, and I have yet to get started on April.. sigh..)
But then again, this is a vacation. I expect to eat very different food...
Link: http://www.livejournal.com/users/merl...
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Two of Ripe's enterprises, the Gotham Building Tavern, and Family Supper, are housed in the same building on the MAX Yellow Line, at the Albina/Mississippi stop, just over the river from downtown. I haven't been to Family Supper since they got a new chef, but it is a great "Portland-y" environment. Gotham Bldg Tavern is reviewed above this thread.
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Based on your tastes and price range I would opt for Alexis over Eleni's - you can eat in the bar off the appetizer menu and do very well for under $20. Definitely have the kalamarakia and the saganaki.
I do like Bijou and considering that you liked Morning Glory so much - I think you will find Bijou comparable and it is close to where you are. I agree with poster below that despite it's popularity I find Milo's to be okay - but if you are ravenous and need something close Bijou will more than fill your needs.
Re: cart food - The Thai cart across from the Galleria (on Washington St between 9th and 10th in downtown) is one of the better carts I have tried as is the Indian cart on SW 12th and Yamhill (Chaat House). There is a plethora of carts on SW 5th between Stark and Oak that should fill any craving you have - they change so I am not as up on these as I used to be.
Happy Hours are a good way to get good food cheap - Green Papaya up on 12th and Morrison (one block north of the Chaat House) comes to mind. Others on this board can help you more with happy hour ideas.
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I had not noticed that Alexis is also on the downtown side of the bridges, so wouldn't be a bad walk. And it's hard for me to resist dolmates that actually have lamb in them...
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