You will have no trouble getting expert opinion comparing encapsulated disc pots and pans that have layers of stainless steel surrounding conducting material. "Experts" will further compare them with pots and pans that have these same or similar layers throughout the entire vessel.
I'm interested in the impressions of those who use their cookware to feed a family--especially a smaller family--with no professional or commercial intent. I have three encapsulated disc pieces: a Demeyere egg poacher saute pan, a Dansk 2 1/2 qt SS Kobenstyle saucepan, and an 8.4 qt. All Clad pressure cooker. I tend to use my 3 disc based vessels to heat up liquids with induction--and they all are just terrific for that purpose.
All my other SS vessels are fully clad. My sauce pans are all tri ply: a layer of aluminum sandwiched between two layers of SS. I have thicker fry pans and a saucier that have five layers, and a nonstick omelette pan that has three layers.
Though I do recognize advantages for the disc pans for certain specialized purposes, I tend to lean toward fully clad cookware--especially the fry pans/saucier. For the sauce pans, I wouldn't expect much difference.
What SS pots/pans do you have? What do you think?
Ray
Disc vs. Fully Clad in Skillets:
Interesting ATK Youtube:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1atGn...
Ray
Earlier Chowhound thread, "Interesting YouTube video about disk-bottom and fully clad cookware"
https://www.chowhound.com/post/intere...
Ray
Any regulars here might know what I have and the saga in getting them. I know you have been there, Ray.
I really like my disc bottom saucepans and saute pan. I feel there is a lot of control with them, too, might be because of the copper element in these. The only thing I had trouble in cooking in them was a custard. I've gotten a nonstick 2.5 qt saucer for that and other things.
I'm very new to clad and disc bottom SS, though. I find even heating with both but you know I have the proline pans, in all three sizes. I'm still learning to cook on those in dealing with getting the right heat because they are hard to adjust. I imagine it's like cooking on cast iron skillets in that regard so I might look up some things that way, too.
One thing, you may be right, Ray, this cookware may last a lifetime but I don't know when I get older if I will be able to handle the cookware. It really takes two people for me. I broke a bowl trying to pour my deglazed sauce into it with the 12.5" proline. I can't hold it with one hand, and I had it propped up on my counter by the long handle, holding the helper, and it slipped so that doesn't work. Obviously, that was a risky move, I was trying to avoid holding it by the long handle and pouring out over the helper handle, I hate that as opposed to the side of the pan but it's too heavy otherwise.
I like the pots, but the saucepans are very bottom heavy and hard to to pour out, too, can't really use my Foley strainer on them either. I hope to build some strength but when I'm older, it might not be so user friendly as they aren't balanced and want to right themselves.
But at least I know they won't warp.
I wish I would have known about that Breville thermopro before. I bet they're a bit more balanced, being clad and disc bottom. And I might be exchanging this Anolon for the Breville nonstick thermopro saucer, BB&B ordered one for me and they used a 20% off so coupon works for the cookware, at least at my store.
Hi VFish,
Thoughtful analysis, as always. Please read the threads I posted and look at the Youtubes (one by ATK; one by Demeyere): they're very informative--and some of the comments are made by users just like us.
Ray
Thanks, Ray, I have been starting to read through them. I've had Century Life's page on that bookmarked and had seen the ATK video before. I'm not really impressed with them beating the heck out of the pans, though, nobody treats them that way but I think the Cuisinart is pretty thin. I wonder if they did try Demeyere, I can't read the results, behind a paywall. I never see them mention that brand ever.
I really think my cooktop has a high potential for warping SS clad, though, I don't trust it, that's why I went with what I did. I'm not moving to gas, induction stoves are not prevalent for the time being. I know Home Depot said they were online only and very little, and I was at Costco last night, they had all electric glass top ranges save one gas stove with cast iron grates. My husband remarked, that's what you want if you really want to cook, but I'm not going there, I need the flat cooktop also as an extra landing space when cool in my small kitchen. I'm not building my stove to fit my cookware, I need my cookware to fit my stove. Someone here suggested to me to lose the glass cooktop after my complaints of the SS pans scratching it which is an unrealistic uneconomical suggestion to make to someone. When it's time for me to move on, it would be to induction which is also glass.
Hi VFish,
It's not so much the testing I was referring to in the ATK Youtube, but the differences they described between disc and fully cladded. They described one disc pan that kept getting hotter and hotter and another that was completely different. That surprised me. The other Youtube was about Demeyere disc vs. fully cladded, followed by Chowhound comments--5 or 6 years ago.
Ray
Yes, it matters. I lean to Clad. All disc bottom cookware is not created equal - if the disc does not cover the bottom of the pan fully it's more of a problem. My only disc bottom pan at home is a stocker, so no concerns there as it only cooks liquids.
Last year we spent some time in a condo (in Hawaii, wish I was there!) that was outfitted with Optio disc bottom cookware. We cooked a lot of rice and there was always sticking with the saucepan I used at the so called "ring of fire" area, even though I removed the pan from heat several minutes before cooking was complete and let it finish by steaming. I was not as happy with the results as I always was in the All Clad. Was sorry to leave Hawaii but happy to get back home to my clad pans!
Hi Ray,
I think one should be careful not to generalise, and instead look at an individual pan's performance.
I mean, two of your links give very contrasting opinions: the cookery school gave All-Clad up in favour of a thick aluminum disc made by Fissler, while ATK completely dismisses disc bottom pans in favour of their overall winner All-Clad - how coincidental by the way :-).
I can already debunk the 2 myths ATK is propagating, namely that 'disc bottoms pans are not durable and poor in heat control'.
As a student, more than 15 years ago, I bought a no-brand Belgium made aluminum disc-bottom stockpot for 10 euro. I still use it a few times a week to boil water for pasta, vegetables etc and have used it in the past for frying chicken - it will be kept in use for another decade or so I think.
Second poor heat control - ATK mentions one pan 'just getting hotter and hotter even though we turned the heat down'. No pan will get hotter if there is no heat. The person doing the test was the one doing poorly in heat management, not the pan. Likewise, I can say that my new Fissler disc-bottom is better in heat control than my old Spring multiply pans which had a tendency to scorch food.
Anyway, the (deleted) link you provided to the other site also gave some positive feedback on disc-bottom. It has been my experience too that searing works extremely good on a thick aluminum disc: I'd be very interested to learn about a comparison between a Fissler cookstar frying pan (or Paderno/Vollrath) and a Proline. I wouldn't be surprised if the Fissler would sear better.
Overall, I have disc-bottom pans, full clad Demeyere, straight copper, and straight ECI in my kitchen, and all are in use. They all have their pros and cons in different stages of a cooking process.
I noticed the cookery school youtube video where All-Clad was replaced by aluminum disc-bottom Fisslers was not linked to in earlier posts: here it is - https://youtu.be/WJvKZiOQesg?t=3m15s
Hi damiano,
Here's what I said in terms of my own use:
"Though I do recognize advantages for the disc pans for certain specialized purposes, I tend to lean toward fully clad cookware--especially the fry pans/saucier. For the sauce pans, I wouldn't expect much difference.
What SS pots/pans do you have? What do you think?"
Ray
Hi Ray,
It has been quite a learning curve for me, but some things have recently been falling into place.
When I was younger I didn't have a lot of pans, so I used the cheap aluminum disc bottom sauce pan I mentioned for pan-frying of chicken. I was always amazed how well it did that job, and even when I purchased more expensive fully clad Spring pans, I kept on using that disc-bottom pan for chicken/meat, until I went straight copper.
Now, with my recent purchase of the aluminum disc-bottom Fissler it makes sense: thick aluminum is excellent for frying. To the extent that I now believe - unlike you - a frying pan doesn't need to be fully clad in my kitchen.
I don't have food cooking on the sides of a frying pan: food is always just sitting at the bottom, whether it's potatoes or a thick steak. So, then I'd prefer having a good sear on the top and bottom of food, helping to cook the insides, over less heat but coming from all sides a full clad offers.
My Fissler suggests that a thick alu disc bottom is also good for long simmers as it is able to hold heat very well at a certain temperature, just like ECI. For a saucier, I'm quite happy with my fully clad Demeyere Atlantis, although admittedly for more complex tasks I tend to pick my copper sauce pan. I do lots of different things in a sauce pan, including frying, roasting and braising, so there I prefer straight copper - just like my saute pan.
These are the ss pans I use.
20cm Demeyere Atlantis saucier (fully clad alu)
20cm Belgium-made disc bottom sauce pan (at least 3mm alu disc)
28cm Fissler Profi casserole (at least 6mm alu disc)
28cm Demeyere Proline (fully clad alu)
Hi, damiano: "I don't have food cooking on the sides of a frying pan: food is always just sitting at the bottom, whether it's potatoes or a thick steak."
Me, too. This aspect of Demeyere's construction theory has never made a lot of sense to me. For example, a cook could just as easily "saute" against the sidewalls of a saute or rondeau.
Aloha,
Kaleo
Frittata? Bacon strips, fish, a sloppy turned pancake?? All these can go up the sides. An apple tart.
Yes they can, und wurst. But if we're talking about frying or saute, it's happening up out of the fat (or something like a frittata displaces some fat).
Don't get me wrong, I'd take a good clad skillet over disk any day. I just don't buy the doctrinal/philosophical distinction that makes clad best for frying and disk best for saute. Seems to me there are at least as many saute/rondeau applications that might benefit from heated sidewalls as skillet applications where you want sidewall heat.
Aloha,
Kaleo
Actually oblong pieces of meat like flank and skirt steak can easily run up the sides of skillets, and retain enough oil on their surface (or have enough intramuscular fat) to sear properly. However, it's unlikely they would sear properly on the sides of a non-clad skillet.
If you didn't want to use a skillet for this purpose, it might make more sense to use a teppanyaki/plancha, since the rectangular shape more closely matches the shape of the meat.
Another oddity for searing in a skillet is a rhomboid flatfish like turbot or plaice, which if sufficiently large can run up the sides of the pan. For this I tend to use either my largest non-stick skillet with conductive sidewalls, or a large oval non-stick pan.
Good point on oblong pieces of meat, and wide fish like my favourite turbot.
But for me the question remains: if one could get an extremely good sear with a very thick aluminum disc, would not having conductive sides be so terrible to the point of being a deal-breaker? Can't an oblong piece of meat just be moved at some point in the pan to get it seared all-over?
I say this because I'm starting to prefer the Fissler for some dishes I could have also used the Proline for.
By the way, I still have a De Buyer oval fish pan, but it has rust spots. This one: https://www.debuyer.com/en/products/c... It's on my to-do list to reseason it and start using it again. I don't cook fried fish that often, nor steaks for that matter - so it's difficult for me to season the De Buyer well.
I think a disc based pan gives more control over the sear, and then also has less sticking to the sidewalls. At the same time, I like the added surface area that a Proline skillet offers, while still being sloped enough to contain the food and even some liquid. I don't believe that food that would cook on the "sides" of a clad skillet would cook the same in a straight side vessel's sidewalls. At least that has not been my experience. My biggest argument for clad saute pans is that they feel a bit more balanced, but this is of course at the expense of more conductive material in contact with the heat source. In short, I have never been cooking in my straight-walled sauté pans and thought to myself, "Hey, I really wish these sidewalls were activated."
Yes, this is an argument for having a properly sized/shaped pan.
I know that few people have oblong or rhomboid-shaped pans, and fewer still have a range of pans large enough for everything they could possibly fry, so clad skillets make some sense.
But by the same logic, so do clad sautes for any foods large enough to abut the walls.
"und wurst" :)
I agree with Kaleo here. If anything, a saute pan, with its straight sides, offers lots of opportunity for food to touch these sides. That's why I prefer copper for a saute pan.
Alexrander, your suggested foods make the case for having multiple frying pans. So, I cook a frittata in an anodised aluminum non-stick pan, and an apple tart tatin in straight copper.
But I can also see myself giving my Proline to my sister and experimenting with an aluminum disc-bottom frying pan/roaster at some point for searing meat etc.
Hi, damiano, I actually prefer the non-clad walls of the Atlantis saute, I don't have to scrape the sides off because the liquid can get thin on the walls and scorch or get caked more easily. I had to do that when I had the regular clad and was doing marsala.
That makes sense, VFish. How are you liking your new cookware by the way? Already feeling more confident in getting good results?
I am very much a newbie, damiano, especially with the prolines! The searing didn't go so well, I think too low of a heat on our NY strips, they still tasted good and I did manage to get them at med rare/medium at least but they grayed mostly! Also, will do two at a time, I thought I could get all four in the 12.5", three was crowded. I was very afraid overcooking it, I hate an overcooked steak. But I might try the sous vide in my Instant pot and then sear at a much higher heat afterward on a London Broil soon. Also, we've always grilled our steaks on our gas grill so I am new to the pans and the indoor searing.
Hi, VFish:
There is a learning curve with the larger Prolines. They take some time to preheat. But they are great pans for holding enough heat to sear more than 1 steak/time. Cook enough, and it will be second nature. In the meantime, you can cheat a little by measuring your temperature (ThermoWorks makes a couple excellent contact probes/thermometers); my experience is that the Leidenfrost/mercury ball point is just above 350F.
There's also the strategy for multiple steaks of goosing the heat right after the flop...
Oh darn, you mean I have to experiment more with steaks? Throw me in that briar patch!
Aloha,
Kaleo
Hi, Kaleo,
I had the heat up to Liedenfrost, it doesn't take much, low medium, and I had it preheated over 10 min. Same with last night's chicken, I cranked the heat up more with the chicken to medium as it didn't seem to browning as well either after Liedenfrost. I don't know, still playing with it. I'm going to make sole meunière tonight with Trader's Joe's fake dover sole but I am going to use my nonstick t-fal!
Hi VFish,
My experience with a glass cooktop led me to preheat a large skillet like the Proline for about 5 minutes at setting 6 or 7 for searing a thick steak. I think low-medium (for even 10 minutes) would be too low for the pan to get hot enough for the initial sear, and allow the temperature to drop too much once the meat is added. The Proline may not be guiding you to the correct Leidenfrost point, in other words. You might consider experimenting with time and temperature for your next few steak attempts, instead.
Also, what is fake Dover sole? Sounds scary.
Cheers,
Andrew
Hi, Andrew,
Yeah, that does sound scary the way I put it! They had it marked as dover sole but I know darn well it's not, probably that pacific flounder, if it is a flounder. It's already cut up so I don't know. We'll see how it tastes. Also it was only 4.99 a pound. I doubt I'll ever taste real dover sole unless some restaurant here might get the real thing. I've been to France twice but was pretty much ignorant about much of their food or else I would have tried it there. I tried to order some good things while there, probably the best meal I had in my life was in Burgandy, including the best tasting wine. Not sure when or if I will be able to get back.
Also, thanks for the advice! I will try medium or probably medium high next time for searing and browning. I did feel that the pan's temp was lowered, even though I had the chicken and beef at room temp for over an hour. I had the chicken marinating in a little wine, too.
Hi VFish,
Yes, it's probably some sort of Pacific flounder marketed to sound more appealing. How did it taste?
One of the primary joys I have cooking in Ireland is having easy access to lots of wonderful fish like turbot, skate, Dover sole, hake etc. These were things I could basically not find at all on the West Coast, or if I could, at totally outrageous prices. By comparison, Dover sole here in Ireland is about €30 Euro/kilo, or $16/pound. A relative bargain!
Cheers,
Andrew
Hi, Andrew,
Thanks for asking, it was okay as a fish, nothing to shout about. I can't compare to Dover sole, that I've read is wonderful. I followed a recipe and I think next time (I bought two packages) I will just use some lemon and salted butter with a little bit of lemon pepper. It was over seasoned and too much lemon zest and I think the salted butter will be just enough seasoning. Also these are very thin and I think a minute a side is better than the two minutes as they were a little too crispy. I should have thought about more about how thin they were and seasoned them accordingly.
If I ever see it on a menu here (there are a couple of French or high end restaurants), I will be sure to order it.
VFish,
We've always grilled steaks in the past. Then we tried sous vide. What a difference. We now feel free to finish them in a skillet or on our aluminum griddle plates on our grill. Both produce a beautiful sear. And they're always like Baby Bear, just right.
So, VFish,
a little more scorching and caking, so you go out and buy a $200 pan? Then, do you get multiple fry pans pans, as damiano suggests--an all aluminum and a copper one? Then, when you switch to induction, you just give away the copper and aluminum fry pans to the Salvation Army?
Most of us will just get an extra can of barkeepers friend and stick with that cladded fry pan.
Ray
Hi Ray, I don't quite understand your point re VFish's Atlantis saute pan? Are you suggesting she should have kept on using her All-Clad even though she was not happy with it?
If so, that doesn't really make sense imho as it's hers to decide how she spends her resources. Moreover, imho this thread confirms my belief that both disc bottom and clad have a place in a well-equiped kitchen.
By the way, what did you think of the cooking school video and their dismissal of All-Clad? https://youtu.be/WJvKZiOQesg?t=3m15s
Hi damiano,
DFish never used All Clad (she returned her d5's because they scratched her glass stovetop)--she used T Fal nonstick--which she replaced because the nonstick coating started peeling.
She was looking at an anodized set costing less than $200 before she was "enlightened."
The cooking school video was really comparing the pattern shifts of two different gas hobs: Wolf vs. Bluestar. When the Wolf went to "simmer", they couldn't get a pot to simmer because only the central circle was emitting gas. Having extra aluminum was a cookware "fix" to a gas jet problem, not an indictment of All Clad.
As I said in the opening OP, I really don't see it much of a factor for most of my cooking tasks.
Ray
Ray, just to be clear, I did use the d5, I used the smaller skillets once (they were unlevel or warped a little) and the 3 qt saute pan quite a bit, also the 2 qt saucepan (purchased at Home Goods) and the 3 qt saucepan. It was the 3 qt saucepan and 3 qt saute pan that I discovered were scratching for sure. Yes, I had to scrape the sides of the 3 qt saute pan and it was too crowded, I have a lot more room and I can use my largest burner with the 4.2 qt Atlantis saute pan.
That video confirms what I have always said, that controlling the heat at the source is much more important than whatever heat comes up the sides. The sides just aren't in direct contact with the heat. IN order to get significant heat up the sides of a thin clad pan like All-Clad, you would have to turn the heat up past the point at which the bottom contents would burn. This is why pans like Sitram and Paderno and Woll, all pans with even heating disc bottom are used in cooking schools and in most restaurants.
Hi, Ray, not sure quite what you mean, I am enjoying the Atlantis saute pan for how it performs, I will say I did my prep work for the coq au vin in the 12.5 proline yesterday, and I had to get out the silicone spatula to scrape the sides a few times when I did my second reduction in the pan, I did the third reduction in the Staub after the braising. So I find the non-clad sides on the saute pan useful, I only have to stir the bottom which seems easier to me and it still reduces nicely. I'm not buying copper for my electric glass cooktop or for possible later induction, though I do enjoy the copper in the disc bottoms. Aren't you interested in the prima matera (sp)?
Hi DFish,
It's a question of whether one is a minimalist multitasker or one who wants a perfect pan for every task.
I still haven't bought a saute' pan--nor have I bought any big ticket fry pans. Still using my two 10" d5 fry pans. But . . .I'm not a complete minimalist, by any means.
Most of my ECI are specialized pieces for certain meals--but they can also be used for table presentation.
Ray
Ray, I am used to using 3 sizes of skillets in my nonstick, I have an 8", 10" and 12.25". Different sizes for different sized tasks, same with saucepans, 1.5, 2.3. and 3 qt pans. The 4.2 qt saute pan was for my all in one stovetop dishes. I got the proline because of warping issues with the 5 plus. I returned the d5 because they were also scratching my glass but I didn't like how they cooked for me either and were such goldilocks pans, neither responsive enough or not enough heat retaining for searing, that it's just as well. I also had unlevelness with the d5, too, either out of the factory that way or could have warped, those were the smaller skillets.
So to sum it up, I have three heat retaining nonwarping skillets, very much like cooking with CI but I suppose more even, one very responsive disc based large saute pan and three very responsive saucepans. I am a minimalist, trying to combine all kind of tasks into these pans, I don't have the room for more. That's why I also have one ECI. I'm sticking with my HA nonstick dutch ovens for the time being, 5 and 10 qt. both from two old sets. I am also feeding a family, that's why we need the extra large skillet and saute pan. A 3 qt saute pan was crowded for us and stovetop meals. You are using your ECI for this, I'm using the Atlantis saute pan 28 cm instead. I'm not buying another rondeau or another stock pot. Besides, I got an Instant Pot if I wanted to make stock.
Hi VFish,
Different strokes.
I've only purchased two 10" SS fry pans--one nonstick and and one SS--plus an omelet pan. Even using them for both frying and sauteing, I don't use them so much for my kind of cooking. In total, not counting ECI, I have 4 "flavors" of All Clad, plus Demeyere, Thermo-Clad, and Dansk Kobenstyle products. My alternative approach, combining SS and ECI, is to use pans with curvature--2 qt., 3 qt., and 3 1/2 qt.. My biggest Staub "perfect pan" WOK is 13" at the top, 4 1/2 qts., and works well for high temperature stir fry searing.
Looks like you've got your feet on the ground. We'll see how you feel in six months--when you have enough real world day to day experiences with your batterie. I'm still learning after 3 years.
Ray
Hi, Ray,
But you're talking to someone who really wasn't into "cookware". I bought my t-fal set and just cooked, not great cooking, but I didn't have to think so hard about it. It was a lot to consider with moving to SS. I might have to go back to my nonstick skillets for everyday stuff, I about murdered one of my Corningware pieces pouring fondant potatoes from just the 9.5" proline. It was a struggle pouring green beans and almonds from the 11" into a serving dish. It's either two people or forget it and I was doing it by myself. I don't like scooping this stuff up, I'm trying to get the sauce, too. I told my husband, when he goes, the cookware goes. This cookware is not for weaklings. When I used my largest nonstick 12.25" for the fish, which is 3.4mm thick, it felt light and I could have played tennis with the pan. I don't know. They perform on the stove but not so much handling it off the stove.
There are definitely pros and cons to this choice I made.
I can see why people love their bare cast iron. My 9.5" proline is soaking because of all the burnt on oil that needs to be scrubbed off. With cast iron, you don't have to scrub off the oil, it helps the pan. Of course with nonstick, it's a no brainer in cleaning off.
I don't know, right now I'm kind of frustrated and thinking why in the world would they make this cookware thinking the average person can handle it pouring from any of it? Yeah, it won't warp on my stove, but if I break another dish, I'm going to be po'd.
I get polymerized oil often also, I hate it. I have found that kosher salt and oil scrub takes polymerized oil off of some pans, but have not used it on Demeyere due to fear of scratches.
Anyone has here tried a salt and oil scrub on Demeyere for polymerized oil, and did it get it off without scratching the pan up?
Otherwise oven/grill cleaner is the way to go. You will scratch it up trying to scrub off the oil using force, that I know for sure.
It is the kosher salt I use, I think the fine sea salt might be a harder grain and may scratch even if kosher does not? I have no idea really, hoping someone else does.
I think I told you, I was a circulon set cook for about 17 yrs. I only have 2 years in on my other cookware, not very long, but so far I only use proline for searing.
I have gotten stronger since I switched. I turned 48 in October and have carpal tunnel in both wrists. I was worried about weight too, but it has gotten easier, actually. Very happy about that.
Hi, LF, thanks for the encouragement. This is why I wanted the 5 plus in the 9.5 and 11 inches. But that didn't work out and the rest is history. When these t-fal fry pans go, I might get the Breville nonstick thermopro if I like this saucier that's coming. I thought I was going to get away from nonstick but now I see there might always be a need. At least it's going to be lighter. My t-fal didn't warp. I wish I could handle that Breville SS thermopro. I'm not crazy about their sets, but these are the disc bottom clad cookware hybrid so it shouldn't warp. It might be just as heavy, I don't know. The fondant potatoes had oil splatters all over the pan on the stovetop and that went in the oven and baked it on. That's why it's even more of a mess. And just earlier I was thinking how easy it was to clean them after my dutch baby today. I had to clean up the 11" a couple weeks ago because I had cleaned it but didn't notice there was still oil on it that didn't show up until I heated it up again. That was horrible so I imagine this one will be, too, because it's not budging so far with Demeyere cleaner, the blue scotch pad, Bon Ami, and BKF for stainless.
BTW, I just turned 49 this month, I know 50 is going to hit me hard. I don't have any problems so far physically, except out of shape for this cookware.
Happy Birthday!!!
Happy birthday! I'm 48 next month. I'm fairly strong and don't have issues with the 9.5 Proline I just received (enablers!) but the larger would be awkward. Barring other issues, strength builds pretty quickly in my experience. Besides, weight-bearing exercise strengthens the bones and our age group needs that ;)
I've read your threads with interest. I'm chiming in without previous contributions because the details of cookware aren't my strong suit. I'm giving away my AC 3 qt sauté and am leaning toward Atlantis as a replacement. My kitchen had/will have an induction cooktop so copper and straight aluminum aren't options.
Hi, Alex, thank you, Happy Birthday to you, too!
Well, the 9.5 didn't give me much trouble but somehow yesterday got shaky pouring the contents out and started to slip and hit my Corningware dish I was using for serving. I guess they don't make those anymore in the pyroceram, now I've been looking at them as more precious items, lol! I broke a small bowl Friday trying to pour out of the 12.5" some pan sauce by myself (stupid of me). I think they still make my dishes we got over 20 years ago when we got married so I'm probably safe there (Mikasa Italian countryside).
I think the Atlantis saute pan is great, especially for dishes with sauces and I find the non-clad side walls a benefit. As I related, I would have to scrape the sidewalls with a spatula on the clad saute pan, I did when I did a reduction with the proline. Some people here have gotten the Fissler saute, casserole, or rondeau and have been very happy. I can handle the Atlantis with one hand empty, I am able to blind grab it off my shelf in the bottom cabinet rather than squatting and pull it out, so there is a little benefit to the long handle. Now if I had my someday future pots and pans drawers, it might be a different story. The Atlantis is very responsive to heat adjustments, but I don't have a Fissler so can't compare. I think some here have said the Fissler is just a tad slower, might not be very noticeable. I like the silvinox, so far it does seem to keep the color bright and silvery. Those who have the Fissler say it's also very easy to clean. I haven't had the issue of polymerized oil on the Atlantis like I have on the proline pans, and I did put it in the oven for the chicken madeira under the broiler. Also, it was noted that the Fissler's non-clad walls are a tad thicker than Demeyere's. However, someone said Demeyere might have better steel (?). I know I was worried before I got the Demeyere, thinking any move would bend it but they've been bumped and nothing (knock on wood). I still try to be careful, though, with any of these pans, including the lids. The lids seem to be decent but some people here say the lids on the Fissler are thicker, too. I know the Pawson lid is double walled and flat. Check your lids, though, I've checked mine as they came in and a few were not level and the pieces were exchanged. The Pawson/Atlantis/Silver 7 are all the same vessel. The Pawson comes with two helper handles as opposed to the long handle on the Atlantis. I never minded rivets before but I guess I could say it's nice not having any, especially in scraping sides, like in the prolines. Fissler's disc bottom is aluminum and Atlantis is aluminum, silver, and copper.
I don't know if there are any other brand disc bottom pans of good quality. I have become interested in the thermopro clad by Breville so if any users speak up, I'd like to hear about it. They have clad walls, though, not sure how thick their disc is. I saw they had a 5 qt saute pan through Bed Bath and Beyond. And when I ordered that Breville saucier, the sales person applied the 20% off, so the coupon worked, which was surprising as Breville is listed as a brand not applicable. Maybe it's just their appliances.
My stovetop is electric glass. I don't have any induction, but I know Libranflight has an induction piece and has said that the Atlantis disc heats up quick. Also, any Demeyere videos featuring the Atlantis and proline all seem to be on induction, so they are a very pro-induction manufacturer.
Hi VFish,
Like you, I discovered problems with heavy pans the hard way. Early on in my induction experiences, I purchased a really beautiful Tramontina 3 qt. ECI saucier as a multitasker. Until I picked it up, I had no idea that it weighed a ton. Early on, I used it to heat up some gnocci dumplings. When I tried to both strain and pour out the hot water, I lost control and the saucier fell into the sink. No damage, but I was steamed--literally. I eventually developed a strategy of resting it on a towel, and gradually tipping it over with one hand, while straining with the other--still risky.
I still have it and use it. Other than weight, it's terrific. But . . .
I've added 2 quart and a 3 1/2 quart cladded pots that weigh much less, and don't use my Tramontina saucier much any more. I realized that any pan with a handle (and even a helper handle) is a challenge over about 5 pounds.
Keep in mind that I'm male, 6' 1", and reasonably strong . . . .
Ray
Yes, Happy Birthday!!! It sounds like you have great cooking ahead of you, as you approach your next big chapter.
If the polymerized oil is not fully baked on, this is what has worked for me (also on Demeyere clad): fill pan with dish detergent (I used Pur), lots of baking soda, and water, nearly to the top --> bring to boil, then simmer for about an hour. Cool down to just enough you can handle pan without burning self. Scrub with a plastic scrubbie. Came right off! (This is after trying a number of other solutions..)
Thanks!
Thanks, Canddc,
It is soaking again, it did start to come off some with the Bon Ami. It's all the way to the top so I'm afraid I can't boil it without it boiling over so trying to keep the dish water hot. It will probably come but what a PIA!
Thank you, I will try that next time I get oil too hot!
LF, also great to wipe off any oil drips before putting the pan in oven - but I'm sure you've figured that out. I just need to remind myself still. :-)
You hit the nail on the head, it is all about the oil and heat level with me. I either get the pan too hot or have the oil too thick, but I am starting to get better at balancing oil and heat, after two years lol. Wiping them out to a dull shine really is the best layer of oil, and then just adding enough fat for whatever you are cooking.
Yes, I have had many lessons but now and then, polymerized oil still finds me. Thanks for the removal tip, I will try your way next time.
Thanks for the tip, canddc, I will try to wipe it off next time, it was already starting to turn brown on the stovetop, though. I still haven't gotten that Dawn dish dissolving power that someone, I think Duffy, recommended. It was $20 so I was hoping to find it cheaper somewhere else. Some people have suggested Easy Off, too, but I am a little hesitant.
About oil: I have been experimenting with using my old Magnalite (aluminum alloy) in the ways described here (getting it screaming hot - yes, Leidenfrost point) before attempting to sear meat. Using oil was leading to the sorts of problems you are all describing. However, the Demeyere booklet suggests butter - so now I'm using that, and it seems to solve the problem.
Hi, medlar,
Butter would burn badly on my stove at high temps, how are you doing it? Are you using ghee or clarified butter?
I have used butter in a proline, the key is to get it searing hot and then put butter immediately before the steak, leaving little time for the butter to burn.
Ghee or clarified would probably be better, and I can't say I've always hit it just right - but what I really like is that the consequences of missing seem so much less annoying than with the oil.
Anyway, it seems as if there is a point when, if meat or fish is ready to go in _immediately_, it is possible to put in a chunk of butter and get the protein on top of it really fast, so that the butter is brown but not burnt. Then as more pieces of meat are added the pan cools a little, so later pieces of butter go a little slower, even though the pan is still hot enough to sear.
Part of it may be catching the pan before it gets too hot in the first place. (Do you have an infrared thermometer? I've wondered if that would help.) But it's also true that I don't mind a dark sear, that you are cooking for more people, and that I am cooking on a gas stove with pans that have relatively thick bottoms but overall are lighter than yours, so the stove/pan setup is quite different. I'm wondering if an oil/butter mix would help.
Hi, medlar,
I don't have a infrared thermometer, someone here linked me to a relatively inexpensive one a month or so ago and I've added it to my "wish list" but haven't gotten it yet. I don't know what temp I'm supposed to be achieving for searing.
I have used oil and butter together many times, especially for onions, which I have to cook low or they will burn instead of carmelize. Sometimes just oil with potatoes and onions,
I'm just hoping I will get a feel soon what temp setting for what purpose soon. I would imagine it would be the same if I was cooking with cast iron, another big heat retainer.
Searing... since writing the earlier post, trying to explain what works for me (again, in Magnalite), I've learned some more, but the current summary is "it's complicated." There could be a new thread just on this topic, though in a recent one <https://www.chowhound.com/post/pan-se...> a rather great variety of pans were in use, and as Kaleo said there, "searing" doesn't have a precise meaning, so it might be difficult to discuss in a meaningful way.
Temperature: turns out it's a mistake to assume as I had that because the "Leidenfrost point" comes up, there is one temperature to be found. (See point 1 below.) So - forget the infrared thermometer, and back to water drops - especially if you stand there sprinkling them on with meat in hand, because the water will, I believe, keep on dancing as the pan becomes more than hot enough, so that things burn instantly. Still, it might be interesting [?] to try checking temperature, and see if it is consistent for one's own particular setup, one pan at a time.
For whatever it's worth, Demeyere says (in booklet and in video below) that frying temperature is somewhere between 340 - 450 F, a rather broad range. Wikipedia says Leidenfrost point might - roughly - occur at 379 F (see point 2 below).
Then BUTTER! There is a YouTube video at < https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W92ai... >- I think Franz refers to this one - with a demo of searing. (Includes links to a batch of others on related topics.) This starts with using butter, NOT using high heat. A demo searing meat in a bare skillet follows - and there they do recommend using water drops to determine pan temperature. Incidentally, I don't think they mention what I also forgot to say - to blot away any moisture on the meat before starting to cook.
--------
1. "As the temperature of the pan goes above 100 °C (212 °F), the water droplets hiss when touching the pan and these droplets evaporate quickly. Later, as the temperature exceeds the Leidenfrost point, the Leidenfrost effect comes into play. On contact with the pan, the water droplets bunch up into small balls of water and skitter around, lasting much longer than when the temperature of the pan was lower. This effect works until a much higher temperature causes any further drops of water to evaporate too quickly to cause this effect." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leidenf...
2. "The temperature at which the Leidenfrost effect begins to occur is not easy to predict. Even if the volume of the drop of liquid stays the same, the Leidenfrost point may be quite different, with a complicated dependence on the properties of the surface, as well as any impurities in the liquid. Some research has been conducted into a theoretical model of the system, but it is quite complicated.[4] As a very rough estimate, the Leidenfrost point for a drop of water on a frying pan might occur at 193 °C (379 °F)..." [same source]
Hi, medlar,
Thanks for your thoughtful and thorough reply! I did achieve Liedenfrost at low/med heat at the time but it was still not high enough for a sear on those NY strips. I seared again yesterday, this time I turned it up to above medium at 6 and they seared much nicer. I'm still playing with it, I still have to go lower for onions and butter.
I appreciate you posting some of those temps as I might go ahead and get that point and shoot someone here linked me to, it's even cheaper now.
BTW, those steaks in their video look way over cooked and dare I say, their sear is also half gray like my NY strips were in my first attempt.
Actually I just looked at their Dutch language site, which has a lot more on it than the English language one. The page below has two shorter videos, one about using some sort of fat and one without. There are English subtitles, which seem to be good translations. AND the meat is not overdone! So maybe more relevant for you.
https://www.demeyere-online.com/be/nl...
If you leave the video on, he goes on to pancakes and then to potatoes... from what you've said it's possible that one might be helpful as well.
I'm not certain this will work, but this seems to be the YouTube address for the potato video separately: https://www.youtube.com/watch?list=PL... - and aha! the links for the other demos I've mentioned are there too, on the right.
The guy from Demeyere is using the cold pan put butter/oil in, heat pan until sizzling stops and start frying technique. I use this technique too most if the time.
Thanks, again, medlar. I don't think I'll boil the potatoes before frying them, I'll just go back to nonstick before that happens! But I hadn't seen those videos before either, so thanks for providing them! I will keep working with these, prolines are not for the unfamiliar user, but I will be persistent in trying.
Try ghee.
Yes, I'd suggested Easy Off. But I personally would use it sparingly. Would prefer a few scratches to using too many chemicals..
Hi VFish,
I also struggle with pan weight, I've got incredibly weak wrists and nerves in them that are prone to zinging if I lift something too heavy. I've settled on (mostly) pans that I can easily pour from. My 2.75qt and 4qt disk saucepans can be a PITA, unless I pour quickly. The wok is a no-go, as is the 12" A-C Copper Core skillet. I lift or ladle food from my sauté pans (nonstick Zwilling Spirit and Sensation). Moving the new 4qt ECI is a job for my mule.
I can see a point coming where I'll want aluminum nonstick discs in almost everything just to keep the weight to a manageable level. I also happen to think nonstick saucepans are under-rated by the CH crowd. I can't recall the last time I built fond in a saucepan. And tonight I had a bitch of a time getting the chuck steak for beef stew to release from the my IP liner, not sure why as the pot was hot when I added oil. So yeah, I get the frustration.
Duffy
Yes, pan weight; I've been wanting to buy a pan (clearly spending too much time reading the enthusiasm here), but am hung up on just that question. I've been thinking about Demeyere 7 ply/3 mm but... Too many choices, I guess.
About the stuck chuck, as I've probably said before what usually works for me is to take the pan off the fire and wait a bit. Usually not long. I suspect the meat starts loosing liquid and releases itself.
What kind of pan are you thinking of buying medlar?
Sorry, there's no short answer! (and except for the impetus of the sales I'm not in a rush), but I'll try. First decision is between a skillet of some kind versus a low pan between say 4 and 6 [?] liters. For a skillet: Proline? - too heavy, and I'd like more of a slant to the sides, even the Pawson, except for the handle; or Demeyere's 7 ply 3mm "multifunction" (among other names) skillet, with double-loop-handles like a paella pan; or the similarly lighter weight "Multiline" (currently in last place).
I'm somewhat intrigued by the Multifunction - shape is off a bit, but the two loop handles seem to offer ease of handling. [As far as I've seen, the multifunction pan is not offered by Demeyere in the US, and maybe not the Multiline either.]
On the other hand, my recently resurrected Magnalite pans are doing fine, while what really needs replacing is ... well, a confession: I have an ancient Dutch "braadpan" that I use for everything from washing and steaming vegetables to boiling up a chicken carcass! (Large vintage cast aluminum or ECI could be used, but all live on top of cabinets and are a pain to access.) So as to what _should_ be replaced, that's it, but so far I haven't been convinced. Criteria: sears nicely, big enough to make a small pot of soup, and easy to clean out with a silicone spatula (making straight-sided pans less interesting). A useful non-stick pan made me think of rondeau shapes, perhaps a little taller than the norm. Eventually I imagine I'll stumble upon a combination of height - width - volume - price that persuades me! Meanwhile I am happy to have suggestions.
Hi medlar,
Ah the quintessential 'braadpan'! I recently replaced a Le Creuset ECI dutch oven by a Fissler casserole - I think it's the perfect 'braadpan' for around 100 euro. It's this one: https://www.amazon.es/Fissler-Profi-O...
Mine is a larger size, 28 cm, but that one is now 150 euro. Another good deal, but probably too large, is this one: https://www.amazon.es/Fissler-Origina...
Note that these Fisslers sell for around 250-300 euro at Dutch retailers. They also have rounded sides on the bottom so you'll have no problems scooping anything out.
For your skillet here is another Fissler deal: https://www.amazon.es/Fissler-Paeller... with the 24 cm selling for 95 euro. There is no consensus here on disc-bottom frying pans. I think it's perfectly fine as long as you have alternatives for eggs and pancakes, and have a saute pan. The upside of the Fissler is perfect browning courtesy of the thick aluminum disc.
A hybrid (clad and disc-bottom) and light-weight alternative to the Demeyere might also be a tip from Andrew (whom I trust 100%) here: https://www.amazon.es/Cristel-sart%C3...
Thank you, damiano! I have looked at the FIsslers off and on, but had not spent much time on them, so it is good to have a push to do that. I really appreciate the details, and what you've said plus the extra pictures on the Spanish Amazon site tell me what I've wanted to know about the shape of the pans' interior. I'll continue thinking about all this....
HI, Duffy,
The prolines are nice but are not for the average user, I think. I was going to reply to your post about your cookware on the other thread, but I could have gotten by with just rebuying my old cookware and adding the saute pan and one proline for searing, if I couldn't sear in the saute pan. Did you know my old set was on a lightening deal on Amazon for $60 during Black Friday weekend? I put myself on the wait list when I saw that, but it filled. A whole set again vs. one nonstick saucier for about the same amount of money. The t-fal skillets maintain well, the saucepans are what failed on me. But another seven or eight years, I would have been okay.
I had gotten the t-fal Ultimate set because my hands would get so chapped and dry with my profession, I was very excited when they came out with this set that was dishwasher safe and only about $125 to save my hands from extra chemicals. I've been on a hiatus from my work the past few years so I'd done more handwashing anyway on my nonstick pots. But my hands are starting to get dry again from all the pot washing especially now that it's winter. I think those extra things I do for the prolines are especially drying, the Demeyere cleaner, the powders, and also that Dawn Dissolving Power cleaner. No, I don't use gloves, or the pans would really slip, I can't feel things with washing gloves either.
I had no problem browning chicken or other things in my nonstick, it was easy to clean, obviously. The Demeyere isn't that bad, especially the sauce pans. The saucepans do come to boil faster than my nonstick did, but are not user friendly when pouring out. I don't know if you saw, though, that I had trouble pouring from that new Breville as well. I think when I get a silicone handle grip of sorts for these pans, I might be able to handle them without them slipping in my hand when heavy. My old set had silicone handles that I had no trouble keeping my grip.
But like I said, I could have gotten by just replacing my old set and getting a couple of SS pans for fond creation and deglazing. That's all I would have needed, really. I agree, one doesn't need fond in a saucepan. I wanted to get rid of my HA nonstick all together but now I see a purpose for it. And it is much lighter weight, they were thicker than the 5 plus, too.
Perhaps you would have done better with the Pawson skillets? They are as thick as the Prolines but noticeably lighter. I don't believe you would have been flipping the 11" one around either way, but they are easier to manage getting them to the stove and cleaning up.
Hi, Randall, I know the Pawson skillets are differently shaped, flatter, but I didn't know they were lighter and still same thickeness. How is that so? I actually like the shape of the proline skillets, it does make them more versatile to me as I've done sauce reductions or simmers in them as well in a dish.
When I get some silicone grips to put over the handles, I might see at least a 50% difference in being able to handle my cookware, at least when pouring things out. The handles are a good feel but the polished stainless is slippery, as it is also in that Breville nonstick saucier I am contemplating on keeping.
The thing about the handle sleeves is that they need to be tight, otherwise the handle can turn within the sleeve. To fit tightly enough, they neccessarily need to be hard to put on/take off. And that means you need to make sure they will either not go in the oven or survive. Given modern "ergonomic" handles' complex shapes, this is a tall order, and most sleeves sold in consumer venues are total crap.
Try what the pros use, available for <$2 at resto stores. See, https://www.webstaurantstore.com/red-.... But you may need to put these on using liquid soap, and you may need to cut them off.
Someone needs to invent a handle wrap tape (like a tennis racquet wrap) that insulates and will not degrade in DWs and 500F ovens. This would also help older cooks with hand neuropathies who need a "fuller" grip (and all All-Clad sufferers).
Aloha,
Kaleo
Hi Kaleo,
What about a silicone side towel? That's essentially what a floppy (floppy being key) silicone potholder will be, only with more grip. It may not aid people with specific grip problems, but it should work for most.
D
Hi, Duffy:
You'd think this would work, but I've tried it and it doesn't. I've tried both thinner silicone potholders and the very thin silicone baking sheet liners. There's not enough surface area in contact, and then any moisture at all makes it internally even more slippery than the polished SS. It's actually dangerous.
Aloha,
Kaleo
I had made a post about this. I am still struggling to find something suitable. I was looking into tool grips as well. My husband is measuring about .875 diameter or smaller than an inch on most handles. I was thinking something kind of flexible and stretchy, like the silicone cover I ordered with the thermapen. It seems most of these covers are too big or made for thin, flat handled carbon steel pans, or the wide shaped cast iron skillets. Understandably so, as they get hot as opposed to someone who wants a grip for a stainless handle. All I want is a wrap. I saw Home Depot has silicone tape, but I don't know about wrapping a tape around it, not sure if it's food grade and heat resistant.
I had linked to this in my post, but I don't think it will fit my diameter or circumference. It's a little short perhaps, too, but it wouldn't cover the end hole or the thumb rest.
http://www.wackywillysweb.com/proddet....
But that would be the concept I am looking for, something that can stretch over the contours of the handle.
I don't know in your link if it's just too flat of a hole, if I can squeeze in the fatter Demeyere handle in there as opposed to a carbon steel skillet. It's also quite a bit of a handle in itself, I'd like to find something that just covers and stretches over the handle, like the thermapen sleeve. I asked my husband does anyone sell silicone tubes I can cut up? He doesn't know of anything. Had me look on mcmasters.com but they had nothing suitable.
My son had used the 2 qt Atlantis saucepan and as he was straining it with the handled strainer, he says, "look mom, it's turning in my hand. We need grips, like the old pots." It didn't sink in until the Breville, also with a polished handle was turning in my hand in pouring something out. It's not as bottom heavy as the Atlantis, although it has a disc bottom, but it's thick all over, too.
Here's a pic of the thermapen cover, with the stretchy silicone. Also of one of my old pots, how it was a thick silicone encapsulating a thinner steel handle. I wouldn't necessarily want a thicker grip, hence something to stretch around the handle.
I have a Thermapen (glow-in-the dark!) boot. These are molded for that specific shape.
I agree that the resto supply sleeves have small, flat openings. This is recognition that they must fit tightly. I have some, and they aren't particularly stretchy. They're made for flat resto handles.
Here's an idea: Why don't the pan makers meke their handle design CAD files available, so someone can offer brand-specific sleeves that actually fit?
I'm surprised the makers of the ultra crappy "one size fits all" clamshell sleeves (e.g., Le Creuset) haven't been sued for scalding personal injuries.
Hi Kaleo,
I referred VFish to the same Web page you linked--with about 25 alternatives, but for SS, it boils down to the All Clad "expanded" handle--reminiscent of the older plastic ones--or the ones that slide over. When this topic was posted before, the obvious solution was mentioned by several as almost a confession--a confession I'll make right now . . .
I just had a situation where I couldn't turn a knob on my toaster oven because my hand was wet--kept slipping. I just grabbed a dish towel, placed it between my hand and the knob--and the knob turned. Helps a lot to handle the handle of my outrageously heavy ECI Tramontina 3 qt. saucier.
Can't beat the price . . .
Ray
Hi, Ray,
I'm looking for something with more grip than a towel to hold these bottom heavy pans. Also, my hands are dry when using them. Perhaps being more dry at this time of year makes them even more slippery in my hands. The Anolon slipped today.
Hi VFish,
My Tramontina Saucier weighs about 9 lbs . . . . .
Took me about three months to come up with that towel solution.
I'm very slow.
Ray
Hi, Ray,
I use pot holders and those oven gloves for things coming out of the oven. But I'm looking for just a grip for the long handles. I don't need a silicone grip for the enameled cast iron piece, I use the gloves and it's very stable. The helper handles, one can put their hand through and it won't slip like the long handle smooth stainless finish on the other pans. The grip isn't for a heat issue either. Just wanted to clear that up. I don't know if you saw the handle on my old pot, that is the concept I am looking for, to give me a grip. I found some silicone tubing that I am going to see if it will fit okay, won't come in until after Christmas, though. I will have to cut the length to size for each piece. It probably won't be a perfect fit because some are smaller than others, plus it's not all the same diameter but we'll see how it stretches and the flexibility.
No one asked whether a side towel does the trick. Just don't use a wet one on a hot handle.
A tied apron allows hobbyists and chefs alike to plunge seamlessly into keeping a side towel handy. I see a software-based solution coming...
Yeah, this is glow in the dark silicone cover, too.
I think I might have found something, won't know how it works until it comes in, I'll report back then. It's worth a shot.
One would think the silicone handles on my t-fal are cheap compared to the nice stainless. However, they are very durable, haven't had any issues with them, and it doesn't slip in one's hands. Not saying they should put these on all high end pans, but I agree, it would be nice to be able to add on grips, since it does make it so "handy".
I'm anticipating a grip would make a difference for me, so hoping it will work.
Truth be told, I don't like how that boot further bulks up the already-bulky Thermapen Contact. The glow is pretty much useless, too. I think the only redeeming feature is the magnet they molded in.
The glow in the dark is only good when you put it back in the cabinet, that's when you notice it's glowing. Although my husband has grilled in the dark, time to time, don't know if it built up any glow enough for it to be useful when he takes it outside. I don't keep it on my fridge.
I only added it on thinking it would further protect it from messy hands, it probably wasn't even necessary, I think I only wiped it off once.
The Pawson pans are shorter, and they also don’t have a helper handle on the 28cm so that knocks a little weight off too.
Hi VFish,
Maybe try these potholders? Reviews say they're really flexible.
Hi, Duffy, thanks for the suggestion. I find silicone pot holders hard to handle, but I also have those jar openers, I suppose same concept. There are a few handle sleeves that are wider and can slide on and off but like Kaleo said and one of my concerns, is if it would start turning inside the sleeve.
https://www.amazon.com/Webake-Silicon...
There's this one, too, with a smaller diameter, but is very expensive in comparison, and not as contouring of a silicone.
Hi VF,
I tried one of the "supposed to fit all pans" sleeves on a Mauviel pan and had the same issue, the handle slipped inside the sleeve. A bigger handle might fit better.
Along the lines of jar openers, something that might conform well is this stuff: https://smile.amazon.com/Multi-Purpos...
After using my Mom's jar opener, I bought a rug gripper (exact same thing, only beige) and cut a few pieces from it. I used them to go under cutting boards, my bread slicer, things like that. They're all gone now, or I'd send you one to try. But it's something that might work, if cut large enough. This stuff is a lot more pliable than silicone. It won't provide a lot of heat safety, but a piece of it stuck in a drawer or hung on the wall might solve your pouring issues.
D
Hi, Duffy,
My Dad has used those rug pads or grippers for area rugs, and I actually have some that was sold as a shelf liner that I've lined some dining room drawers. I guess it must be a catch-all item! Perhaps, I will pull one out and test it, but I did order some silicone tubing to see if that would work, by stretching it over the handle.
I recommend that drawer-liner stuff too. Years ago I bought a couple of pieces marketed as jar openers, and they are really good for that! More recently I've bought rolls of it for miscellaneous uses. Might be good to have around for occasional use, e.g. if you don't put handle covers on all pans.
I went ahead and ordered that set of 12 rounds. I was recalling all things I used to use the stuff for. Under a bowl or cutting board, it keeps them from sliding. Under a hot cup or bowl it protects my wood counter. And they're great for opening jars, too.
It's arriving Sunday. I'll report back about how well it secures pan handles.
Hi VFish,
My order of little grippy things arrived today, and I tested one out on a few of my pans. Definitely better than a bare handle, but not as good as a silicone-coated handle. I place it about 75% of the way to a coated handle. If the tubing doesn't work, I think they'd be worth a shot.
Duffy
Hi, Duffy, thanks for the update! My tubing won't come in until after Christmas supposedly. I will keep these on my wish list!
Well, there is Plast-Dip: https://www.amazon.com/Performix-0758...
Comes in a spray, too, FWIW.
Aloha,
Kaleo.
This reminds me of "Sugru moldable glue." Might it allow putting on a layer of silicone and squeezing to make it fit your fingers? I've mentioned it elsewhere - quote below - but note that "heat resistant," means "Comfortable at high and low temperatures up to 180°C (356°F) and down to -50°C (-58°F)." Incidentally, looks like a 4-for-3 sale is on at present; may not apply to Target, which apparently has some sorts.
"... there is a DIY product called "silicone * modeling clay." I haven't used it, but it is supposed to "turn into rubber" and to be heat resistant. As I recall, the main disadvantage seemed to me that once a packet was opened it needed to be used fairly soon. [And it's not cheap.] If you try it, please let me know how well it works -
https://sugru.com/about [https://sugru.com/ gives ideas for uses]
https://www.wired.com/2009/12/sugru-a...
ETA: * Wired said "silicon," Sugru says "Silicone." Whatever."
I'll keep it in mind, I wouldn't want to mar the surface, though. I'll wait and see how this works.
A friend had send me a silicone handle cover, I like it, which pan are you looking for it to fit on? If I have that pan, I will test for you. Sorry, I have been so busy, I am behind on all the conversations.
I have a real problem with dry hands myself.
Hi damiano,
We cook different things. Two of my three fry pans are nonstick, and used with lower temperature cooking. When I made scrambled eggs a few days ago, I set my induction unit on 250 degrees, and used my light weight nonstick pan that I can easily move around. It took less than 3 minutes from when I put the pan on my induction unit to putting the scrambled eggs unto my plate.
When I made mashed potatoes from about 8 potatoes for Thanksgiving, I used a 3 1/2 qt. cladded sauce pan to boil the potatoes, strained out the water, and mashed the potatoes in the pan. I could also have used a disk pan, if I had one, or my 4 qt. ECI legumier. When I get higher temperature frying tasks, like your chicken example, I cut up the chicken and stir fry in my ECI "perfect pan" WOK.
My demeyere egg poacher is disc--but it could have been cladded. All I use it for is to heat up water to poaching temperature. When I make oatmeal, I sometimes use my 1 1/2 qt. cladded saucepan; other times, I use my 2 1/2 qt. disc based saucepan. It really doesn't make much difference.
You use your Fissler disc based casserole for long simmers; I get perfect simmer control of temperature with my induction, and one pot meals from my ECI.
Different strokes for different folks.
Ray
I totally agree with this sentence:
"Overall, I have disc-bottom pans, full clad Demeyere, straight copper, and straight ECI in my kitchen, and all are in use. They all have their pros and cons in different stages of a cooking process."
You just pick whatever tool is best for the job, right? And sometimes there are more then one tool for the job but there is most likely a user preference or just whichever is closer or not in use.
That is how I roll, anyway.
And I know it seems I am "down" on cast iron, but you know I still used the terrine and the oyster pan this week, in the oven. I do not hate bare cast iron or ECI, I have both, but I did learn that they are not the best stovetop cookware. This makes them less useful to me and not the best material for some pieces so that I wished I did not buy so much of it, not that I wished I hadn't bought any at all.
LF,
a few caveats---
Everything depends on what you cook--and home cooks are especially different from each other.
But
With a high BTU gas stovetop and at least one big oven, damiano's statement makes a lot of sense. For lesser gas and electric units, not so clear. For induction, it's a different ball game.
Ray
I have a set of Fissler cookware, the "Profi" line. I find that:
1. It conducts heat evenly enough I can boil sugar in it for peanut brittle with no hot spots and no burning, which my previous Cuisnart disk bottoms wouldn't do.
2. It's excellent for making white sauces without burning
3. It works for all around cooking - boil, saute, shallow fry, (don't do a lot of deep fry so I don't know), low heat, high heat, etc.
Personally when I learned that All Clad said 'don't use things about medium heat' that was a non starter for me. Pasta pots get high heat - otherwise how do you have 4-6 quarts of water for pasta or potatoes?
The only reason I haven't given a more extensive response here is because I believe the OP's original question is loaded, since it implies that cookware differences that matter in a commercial setting might not matter at home. It also strongly implies that there is some overarching conflict between advocates of clad- and disc-based pans. Most experienced cooks find room for both in their kitchens, and if they don't, it's probably not based on anything objective.
Andy,
Here's what I said,
"Though I do recognize advantages for the disc pans for certain specialized purposes, I tend to lean toward fully clad cookware--especially the fry pans/saucier. For the sauce pans, I wouldn't expect much difference.
What SS pots/pans do you have? What do you think?"
I value your comments.
Ray
Hi Ray,
The skillet/sauté disc/clad issue has been hotly debated for about 80 comments, so I'll stick to saucepans. Your guess is right, it makes no difference, at least on induction. With the heat control we have, especially at the low end, I grab whatever is handy for things like melting chocolate. Clad saucier (Meyer Bonjour), disc saucepan (Optio) or nonstick disc saucepan (Anolon Nouvelle), they're all the same and I don't need a double boiler. Making a roux is equally easy in them all, I can get it exactly the color I want, without worrying about scorching or overcooking.
Beyond that, it's only about size. I use the one that fits the best. I normally reheat in the Anolon nonstick 2qt or my 10" nonstick skillet, but that's largely about convenience, because with a squirt of soap and quick rinse the dishes are done.
Duffy
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